Being Whole With Lorah Gerald

[00:00:00] Hello everybody welcome to another episode of Thriving Adoptees podcasted on delighted

[00:00:07] to be joined by Lorraine.

[00:00:08] Array for Lorraine, she's back again, Lorraine.

[00:00:11] Hey Simon, my friend.

[00:00:15] It's been too long.

[00:00:17] Yes it has.

[00:00:18] We're a foot away or about three and a half thousand miles away, four thousand miles away.

[00:00:24] Yes we are.

[00:00:26] Our ancestors are the same through DNA, I know that.

[00:00:30] Through DNA.

[00:00:32] Yeah and do you know Jude?

[00:00:35] Do you know Jude hung in there?

[00:00:37] She was with the five side of Dr. Tees people.

[00:00:40] I don't think personally now.

[00:00:43] So we share our ancestors with her because she's got some Irish roots too and I went to Dublin yesterday.

[00:00:50] Not yesterday?

[00:00:51] No that's Friday.

[00:00:52] I went to Dublin that's Friday, to meet her for the day.

[00:00:55] How do you get done?

[00:00:56] Wow.

[00:00:57] And we did a bit of a Facebook live which was a bit weird but anyway it's good.

[00:01:01] So trying to meet more people in person, just trying to meet more Adoptees friends in person.

[00:01:08] Me too, I did that with the Adoptees Connect Tulsa group.

[00:01:12] Yeah.

[00:01:13] I saw your post, I saw your picture of that.

[00:01:16] Was the one guy there if I remember rightly?

[00:01:19] I know he couldn't make it on Tuesday but he did message me so hopefully he'll be there next time.

[00:01:26] Otherwise it's all girls together right?

[00:01:28] Yeah, right now it is.

[00:01:30] Yeah and but you being in the Adoptee community kind of know that that there's the sport.

[00:01:36] The sport.

[00:01:37] The sport.

[00:01:38] The sport.

[00:01:39] The sport.

[00:01:40] The sport.

[00:01:41] Yeah.

[00:01:42] Why do you think that is?

[00:01:43] Well I would say it's because men usually are raised to you know you're the provider, you suck it up.

[00:01:48] You don't talk about it and society has done a great harm to men by making them explode out and not know how to communicate what their needs are so that they can be fulfilled themselves besides always providing for others and not being allowed to provide for themselves.

[00:02:10] Yeah.

[00:02:11] I've been having this talk lately because he's feeling very stressed and I'm like well what are you feeling stressed about?

[00:02:18] We need to find out what you need right now.

[00:02:21] And then he'll turn around go hey you want me to cook you dinner or something?

[00:02:24] I'm like do you want to cook me dinner or are you doing it because you feel like you need to.

[00:02:29] Yeah.

[00:02:30] And I'm like would you like me to cook you dinner tonight?

[00:02:33] Because we trade off you know.

[00:02:35] Yeah.

[00:02:36] And it's like I can tell your stress maybe tonight is not the night that you cook maybe then tonight is the night you sit now.

[00:02:42] Yeah.

[00:02:43] Yeah.

[00:02:44] Here in the UK there's a scary staff.

[00:02:48] So we're flying around that the biggest killer of men under 35 I think is suicide.

[00:02:57] Because we don't we don't talk about our emotions right.

[00:03:03] We suck it up but see we wouldn't say that because we're we're British you know.

[00:03:09] Right of course of course of course.

[00:03:14] The female brits are like.

[00:03:20] Well we've got the stiff upper lip right so.

[00:03:23] Right yeah and that's the reason why the very few brits on this show you know like.

[00:03:31] Very few brits is it and have you heard that we're we're well we think that you're American and you over not you personally.

[00:03:43] Yeah I know you was.

[00:03:45] We think you and well we think that you overshare on your emotions right and we as some some of us might say oh you've got a therapist have you not got any friends that would be a typical.

[00:04:03] Yeah from from some of the.

[00:04:06] If I didn't have a therapist I wouldn't have any friends.

[00:04:11] Because my friends that they became my therapist they'd be like oh dear lord.

[00:04:18] Yeah well here in the United States look at who does all the mass shooting right it's it's men typically always something like 99% of the time.

[00:04:30] Yeah.

[00:04:33] Okay I was going to go into a political thing now that's not do that.

[00:04:38] Yeah the other one was the other one was thinking about the men.

[00:04:43] Oh yeah men and outside help right so it's not just it's not just therapists so I've had a lot of business coaches over the years.

[00:04:53] And you know I got I got the I got the Mickey taken out of me I got the piss taken out of me for that by by quite a few friends and some of them would say it behind.

[00:05:09] So say it behind the back not to my face either but one of the ones who was particularly the cipherance.

[00:05:18] I don't use every ex what the one so was particularly yeah talk talks about that a lot and he went bus twice.

[00:05:26] So maybe he could have done with some external external perspective on on on here him maybe him or maybe his business or maybe so.

[00:05:37] So healing yes I should have made a nice link that she's time.

[00:05:44] So yeah maybe there was something slightly off with that friend of mine and maybe he should have been seeking more healing.

[00:05:52] And then so here we are today to talk about healing that would have been a BBC kind of way to do it to make a nice segue.

[00:06:00] That was a segue.

[00:06:02] Yeah so healing.

[00:06:04] Healing.

[00:06:05] Sit mean to you.

[00:06:07] Well when I was a kid I used to think healing was when I scraped my knee and I got a scare.

[00:06:13] Yeah I didn't really think about it.

[00:06:18] It wasn't until if we're talking about mental health healing which is what we're here for.

[00:06:27] It wasn't until things kind of exploded out because I had moved along through my life because here in the US you know you work hard.

[00:06:38] Hustle hustle hustle the more you hustle the you know more things you're going to be able to have the big house cars you know everything.

[00:06:45] You know so it's hustle culture here and you don't have time to heal in process and take care of things I mean even when people give birth or have a death in the family

[00:06:58] I mean you be back to work you know as quick as possible you know you have a major surgery whatever it is you have a car wreck your house burns down well can you come back to work tomorrow.

[00:07:07] You know they don't allow for processing of how you actually feel you literally have to go well I got to cram that down as fast as I possibly can.

[00:07:19] And that doesn't work it will come out in some other way people will say i'm fine but then they'll go have a drink every day or they'll go sit in front of a video game or a movie or whatever it is that we numb out to.

[00:07:33] And it's unhealthy coping mechanisms but we think we're fine i'm as guilty as that is anyone else but healing was when I found out what I needed to be the best version of me.

[00:07:51] And then I now as a Kundalini yoga instructor trauma informed therapist can help other people and because of the what a lot of people don't like to talk about is how we're all one.

[00:08:07] That's how it happens is when you heal yourself you can heal the world because you've seen it within yourself and then it spreads out like an energy.

[00:08:20] And you see the oneness.

[00:08:27] Do we see the oneness as well yes because you have become whole and it's in everybody goes well is it just one time thing will know we're going to be healing and becoming whole and authentic continually because we do our needs change and it's about knowing what we need and knowing what we feel.

[00:08:49] At the time and that changes over time so sometimes our belief systems will fall away you know they'll die off and new neural plasticity you know our neurons fire new ways and we're like oh wow I have new information now and how I used to feel isn't relevant now.

[00:09:12] I have this new way of thinking that is getting me to the highest the highest vibration of myself the highest me the you know the big me the whole authentic me.

[00:09:28] Yeah if you need parts we're in parts sorry oh many many many parts yeah I did so much parts therapy also known as internal family system I have I did that with my therapist for a long time and it was extremely helpful to me when I everybody well I talk about this in my yoga classes you'll find the answers in the quiet parts.

[00:09:55] And with parts therapy I got to go into the quiet parts and literally listen to the parts that were screaming inside of me wanting attention so like if I was angry was I really angry at that person or was I angry at something else.

[00:10:12] And I would catch myself and I'd be like oh I'm not really angry at them that's you know whatever part of me needed attention you know it wasn't being seen or heard properly and so instead of lashing out now I can go okay maybe I need to spend more time with me and figure out what's going on.

[00:10:33] Yeah.

[00:10:35] The reason I asked about the parts work is because I think they refer to the the true as as the uppercase as self in in in parts work so it and I I've spoken to quite a few people you know interview quite a few therapists on the show that into parts work.

[00:10:57] And I read this book it's pretty good it's a book it's a good book the the Ditch Worts book no bad parts which for me the title says it all like because it resonated for me because I have judged some of my parts as bad right so when somebody comes up with a title like no bad parts.

[00:11:23] Then that is scrambling my belief system right that was scrambling that's scrambling my belief system in a good way what you mean that there are no bad parts that he is that what you're saying Mr. Schwartz Richard to your friends Mr Schwartz whatever is that what you're really saying that are no no bad parts even the bits that is streaming the head off like your little one or the explosive little

[00:11:52] lost little lad Simon you know with these volcano you know if volcano occasionally volcano occasionally exploding what's the word what do I explain what what volcano is doing there's a word no they're explained.

[00:12:11] They do explode yeah I thought those are different words and so talk to me about beliefs and healing.

[00:12:21] Because it's one of my areas of entry in the in my expense in the adoptive world it's basically it's trauma all the way and we don't often hear the word beliefs we don't often hear the word belief systems we don't often hear the word self limiting.

[00:12:46] We don't hear any of that other than the belief that we're not good enough we sure see we talk about all the time but the broader belief systems don't really get a look in front well that's kind of my perspective do you think is it just me I'm I'm a lot of people talking about beliefs and I'm missing them or is that a fairish view of tea spasins.

[00:13:13] Well let me start here you don't need to be talking just tell me no no I was like I have to have a thought process and I have to start somewhere my little OCD brain kicked in and I was like okay so to start our brains go to what's familiar.

[00:13:30] And that's not good or bad sometimes our brains are stuck in the trauma right and they play that programming over and over and over again and it may not be what's best for us but it's what's comfortable.

[00:13:47] And so that's where I think the belief systems lie is because we're in this comfortable moment with our brain and our brain wants to stay there even though that's not where we need to be we need to get uncomfortable.

[00:14:03] And move through it and then the uncomfortable moments that's where we want to lash out that's where we're exploding were the volcanoes we explode at people because we become uncomfortable and our brain is like fighting it desperately because it wants to go back to that comfortable familiar state.

[00:14:20] That our beliefs have a stuck in if we become more aware of our own feelings and needs in those parts we start seeing oh I you know that's not them or that that I'm angry about I didn't get seen or treated the way I wanted to as a child or I was bullied at school or

[00:14:49] whatever that old programming is that keeps us in that defensive state where our sympathetic nervous system you know is kind of active all of the time so that we can launch out our muscles or tense a lot because it's healing is physical mental emotional and spiritual we have four bodies and we need to heal them all.

[00:15:12] And some like cognitive therapy that's you know that's just going to be talking about it is not going to be the somatic part where you're getting really into your body where you're moving it out and integrating it all so the belief the new neural pathways can be created through like what I do breath work and yoga and things like that people have different ways of doing their mindfulness practices as long as they're doing their mindfulness practices they will be creating those new.

[00:15:42] So the neural pathways so the comfortable can be a new comfortable and then that belief system can be changed did that answer what you were.

[00:15:54] Yeah there's a lot there there's a lot of death on me to impact and first of all I wanted to apologize for jumping on you and on that question that I asked a couple of minutes ago sorry I didn't mean to do that.

[00:16:07] So I first thing then are you saying that we are comfortable in our trauma because that's what we know.

[00:16:17] Yeah your brain will literally keep you in whatever is normal for you and that's why you see a lot of people that are very unhappy depression anxiety all of these diagnosis we get go back to the trauma.

[00:16:36] And until you face it head on and we do need i'm not saying cognitive therapies bad I don't want that to be confused we do need that but we need other parts to like the somatic experience we need to be creative we need to be in the moment we need to be aware.

[00:16:55] And there are steps to that cognitive is only one of them because you do need someone to witness what's going on and sometimes those people are really good sometimes not to help us see the path forward.

[00:17:11] But until you yourself do it it's just other people giving you advice it's it's not going to help you have to do the work just like they say put your own oxygen mask on first that's true you have to do that's five right if you don't you can't breathe you're over.

[00:17:29] You've got to do that you have to put the action into it so you're going to have to make yourself a little uncomfortable in a healthy way through whatever mindfulness practice such you're choosing to practice whatever therapist you're choosing to go to you have to put the action in because you have to change your body on that cellular level those new neural pathways and things have to be created by you no one else can do it.

[00:17:58] Yeah. So the belief stuff that seems to me very heady very brain oriented is very and we're assuming the mind is the brain which is over simplification clearly but we've got with so we're looking at this from two two angles with brain and body.

[00:18:24] You know like I'm thinking it's oversimplifying really so brain you know the the beliefs are in our brains and you also talked about the somatic stuff but so that's just that that's that simplifying it to two areas of the levels of healing but you said for you said which is probably more I presume that's more accurate way of looking at it.

[00:18:52] It's how the in yogurt teaching that's how we look at it.

[00:18:57] Can you repeat the can you repeat the for just starting to give all the map yes it's the physical mental emotional and spiritual.

[00:19:07] And spiritual so the physical stuff is then like this.

[00:19:20] The body so that's like the somatic stuff and the breath were talking about yeah and the mental we're talking about the belief story the beliefs yes.

[00:19:33] The belief systems and the story the story of us and the narrative correct the emotional stuff what those are feelings those are your feelings you know like you get a gut feeling or it made you sick to your stomach you know those are saying that when something happens you feel it in truly in your gut a lot but but your emotions are stored in your body.

[00:20:02] Yeah and the got stuff and then the spiritual one right and that's where you feel bigger than yourself and you understand your part in the universe or with you know whatever term you use.

[00:20:17] Yeah so what which bits do you think get under and under explore should we say or over explored or or you know to a certain to get the balance to a certain to get the balance right across those for how do you see that balance.

[00:20:41] Well that that definitely comes with work because you could focus on one or the other like if you're feeling sick a lot you might go to a medical doctor that would treat you.

[00:20:56] Physiolod you know your body and they might just give you a pill and say okay well maybe you're migraine you know here's a pill for your migraine but what was causing your migraine or her nervous why did it all of a sudden come up well then you might want to go to the emotional part of it and go like with parts therapy and find out the underlying cause of the symptom because that's what happens a lot is we we peel it out or numbing out and then you can see.

[00:21:26] And then we don't get down to the root of it and then you go oh okay my inner child is wounded and then that's when you know the physical aspect you're going to have to move that trauma out so you're going to have to start doing a mindfulness practice you know again whatever it is jogging walking whatever you're doing to actually integrate the physical aspect of it and then you can usually move up to the spiritual seeing more than yourself.

[00:21:55] Yeah.

[00:21:56] How we are connected.

[00:21:58] So might take presumably you've read Primal Word isn't it?

[00:22:04] Yes I have.

[00:22:05] And you read the follow up book as well.

[00:22:07] I did not.

[00:22:08] No okay.

[00:22:09] Interesting we looked at some stats while I was online maybe it was on a conversation but there's something the day and there's something like 1400 reviews of the Primal Word but there's only 190 the follow up book.

[00:22:24] Which is an interesting one.

[00:22:27] And from what I can recall of the follow up book it was all about psychological or to use this structure here the mental stuff.

[00:22:38] It was all about that and it it's um that may be my recollection maybe off right because it's a while since I read it but for me it it was it was lacking

[00:22:52] anything on the physical stuff probably touched on the emotional because that's mental and emotional kind of go together but on the spiritual stuff she mentions it every now.

[00:23:02] She mentioned at the start I think but I don't really remember much of that so I think for me that's you know we're looking for the whole I'm with you on the whole deal we're looking across this at the whole a whole deal.

[00:23:16] So I've just started some I just started some some at it.

[00:23:22] Work.

[00:23:23] You.

[00:23:25] And you know the body keeps a score is a good book that talks about kind of all of it they don't really talk about the spirituality part of it but they get the rest of it.

[00:23:36] Yeah and that I've listened to that and yeah it didn't it didn't really do a lot for me but maybe that's because I'm just.

[00:23:45] Tuning out of my body and maybe that's what I'm doing with the somatic therapist right it's like it's difficult I think to you know to put logic and body stuff together.

[00:24:00] But what I did like about the rich and swat stuff the the IFS so internal family systems, rich and swats founder and then they also call it classwork is all the same thing.

[00:24:16] What what I like is that he did bring in he did bring in that spiritual so he was looking at mental emotion and and spiritual from why can we call listening to the book because he talks about this uppercase as self doesn't it.

[00:24:36] And that's as the essence of who we truly are right and that bit that is beyond our thoughts and and and feelings and not.

[00:24:49] Not not wounded by the trauma right yeah you can move about your day to day in the moment.

[00:24:59] And I always like to see it as we're just floating down a river you know things are going to go up and down obviously and we can even get some rapids in there but we can still float above it and not be sucked down into it.

[00:25:13] Now when you get sucked down into it and that does happen it does happen I had a little spiral back earlier this year I had flew I couldn't work out I was sick I started getting depressed and I but I knew why this time so.

[00:25:28] Part of the healing now is even when you get really down you can go I know what this is don't listen to the lie bring yourself back out of it and of course the minute I could start working out it started helping me I started pulling myself out of the dark place.

[00:25:49] So this is I was feeling better too physically so that's that it's it's almost sounds almost child.

[00:25:57] It's simplistic to say it but I'm going to say anyway so I finished but we're talking mind body soul connection here you know so if we are low by sickness then often will low psychology which is yeah who's no one's brought everything together

[00:26:15] in the adoptive in the adoptive world I mean no one's bringing all the I I've been I teach this in my class that we have to work on all of this together because one or the other you know it only if it's only going to affect that one part and we really are everything you know our story

[00:26:43] and emotions how we feel and our place in society it's all of it and we have to function on that level so sitting on the mat and breathing and becoming aware of your feelings and what no matter what it is whether it's you know sad happy angry joy or this whatever it is it's fine and you can when you slow down and just observe it

[00:27:11] and go okay it's fine I can see it and I can just let it flow.

[00:27:18] So what have been the most healing moments for you the right?

[00:27:25] Well after reunion when I hit the lowest of low and I basically did have a whole break with reality

[00:27:36] and I was where you know the dark night of the soul people talk about this and rebirth this is where it happened because I was really uncomfortable it wasn't just a little uncomfortable this was this was everything that I knew every belief system in me broke

[00:27:56] people be like that's the most healing and I'm like yes because then I became authentic I let go of what I had been death grasping on to you know because that was my familiar I let it go

[00:28:13] and I said now I can actually figure out who I am who am I and at that moment I started taking those steps towards who I am now

[00:28:27] and who I will be 10 years from now.

[00:28:30] Yeah so breaking as a neighbor of ours is a therapist and she talks about breaking down to break through which sounds kind of like a son of a what was going on for you.

[00:28:52] Yes and so can you give us a flight we mean you said that the belief systems crumble I think did you say that word yes yeah and so can you give us an example of this of the belief systems that crumble or what what change for you just a bit more just paint a detail on to.

[00:29:13] Well it was mainly about who I was as an adopted person you know I grew up with a family that loved me but I was not like them I never got to talk about really any my feelings because you're adopted you're one of us you know is just just one talked about and my parents never dealt with their trauma so I never dealt with my trauma

[00:29:39] and the beliefs that I had were that my birth mother actually loved me and when I found out and it really sunk in that I had always been a dirty little secret in her shame not her love that just seeing my sisters how much you know we were alike the feeling I got around them being around biological relatives the first people I'd ever heard.

[00:30:08] First people I'd ever been related to and touching them and seeing them and talking to them in our mannerisms being alike everything fell apart because I felt like I had lived a lie I had not been who I truly was supposed to be I had lived who I was expected to be in my adoptive family so the break in reality was hard

[00:30:35] and I did have to come to the realization that my birth mother did not want me which was anybody has to live with that knows what that is it's not to be bypassed that is a trauma that is a part of you just like if you lost a loved one that you was you know your partner or whatever when they die you can move on yes.

[00:30:56] But there is something inside of you that is it has the you know the concede the crack and you're filled it back up with the goal but it's still a crack in there doesn't mean you're not whole you are but it's a part of you now so that it was a part of me that I had to accept that it was her that couldn't face it

[00:31:22] and I had to move on without her in that shame so I had to let that go just like I had to let the guilt go of how I felt about my adoptive parents so I started accepting those parts of me that I didn't like because the guilt and the shame they were in there but I had to see them for why they were there

[00:31:49] and when I did I was like okay I did the best I could I'm a human being I have that in me but I also have love and joy and I'm creative and I can be whole and still know you know that that doesn't have to wait me down that's just a feeling

[00:32:09] it doesn't wait me down it's not who I am I am not shame I am not guilt so moving through it integrating it acceptance and also I hate to say it but sometimes little gratitude too because I can help other people and I can see it in myself when I'm behaving badly

[00:32:33] and that helps others because I'm like hey I'm sorry you know I can accept my pardon things I can be accountable for my actions and hopefully make the world a little bit better while I'm here.

[00:32:47] Yeah. Yeah, well it's um you got me on some tears sign up you know this thing so my most healing moment was really realizing that I'm worth it.

[00:33:17] I'm not me. I'm not me and she did and she did and you had the hundred and fifty degree experience the way yeah wow and it's okay it's okay I've got dealt with it.

[00:33:35] I've got I've got goosebumps all over. It's our energy.

[00:33:47] I had this weird thing happen to me about two weeks ago I've got this tingly feeling bit like I'm feeling now from a good thing

[00:34:05] good feeling a good thought or you know something uplifting right and then about four hours later I got the same feeling when somebody surprised me coming the other way walk when I was walking the door.

[00:34:25] I had the same tingly feeling so the tingly feeling I thought the tingly feeling was equals good thing but the tingly feeling was actually shocked and surprised I was walking with my head down you know changing you know selecting new podcasts to listen to or whatever it was doing but sending a message for an email that's what I do.

[00:34:49] If I am out and I'm listening to a podcast and I hear an idea I send myself an email and then I will keep it down.

[00:34:57] So the same feeling the same physical sensation was actually to do with a good thing and a bad thing and that really messed my mind up because I thought physical sensations were

[00:35:19] always pointing to the same sort of thing so when you're talking about a feel you know sit to the gut or something what did you say yeah like you heard people say I felt it in my gut or I got a feeling in my gut and that's true because our vagus nerve which is our longest cranial nerve

[00:35:47] and it was basically from better eyes all the way down to like our pelvic bone and a lot of its right around the stomach area so like what I do in my Kundalini yoga we will do breath work that we push our bellies like in and out and things like that's called breath fire.

[00:36:07] It goes really fast and it works the solar plexus well it works that nervous system of yours just like when we're doing left nostril breathing it's affecting our right hemisphere which is the parasympathetic and then vice versa right goes to the left hemisphere which is the sympathetic and will do opposite nose breathing affecting the nervous system back and forth.

[00:36:30] So when someone startles you in that sympathetic goes off the parasympathetic can come back into play and balance you back out quicker because you've been practicing this all the time that's why yoga is called a practice you don't someday win yoga you know it's not like you win a race or something you practice yoga it is I try really hard to get this through to people not going through a little joke in there too but there are things we're supposed to do every single day.

[00:37:00] We're supposed to eat sleep poop and we're supposed to move our bodies we have to do something physical whether it's walking the dog like you said practicing yoga if we don't move our bodies get that nervous system going back and forth when the shit hits the fan we're going to lose it we're not going to.

[00:37:22] You know our brains aren't going to kick on and go okay we've done this we're ready we practice this you know the sympathetic is flooding our nervous system right now don't let our frontal cortex go offline because then we're going to panic and we're going to lose it so we we're going to breathe now.

[00:37:38] Now you know we calm it down and go okay I can think I can think even though you might be in the middle of shaking or whatever it is you can go I can think I can think my way through this because I'm going to follow my breath and i'm going to make it through this because I know I can't but people that don't practice these things in their body and become aware of it they're the ones that are more likely to go off the deep end because once that sympathetic nervous system which is the primal that's our primal brain it's going to keep us safe.

[00:38:08] So if it gets stuck which is what happens to a lot of adoptees.

[00:38:13] Our parasympathetic just you know it can't come back online so that's the brain body all of kind of through a little bit all of it at you at one time.

[00:38:26] So we've looked at healing on four different levels then physical mental emotional and spiritual now I heard I was trying to a fellow adoptee and I think this was for it's like a pre interview conversation not actually an interview on Monday so a few that we're doing this on Thursday listen.

[00:38:51] And she had another one which was she called it I think she called it relational or social and I thought that so that because I thought of I started off with basically psychological spiritual right and so that I'm working on this healing framework at the moment and I think you've you've added you've

[00:39:20] you've responded the question I can't remember my brains adult but so when I was looking at this healing framework I started off with two right spiritual spiritual healing and psychological healing.

[00:39:33] And then I went to kind of three because I thought my body sold and then talking to a fellow adoptee on Friday as I'm going to eat she talks about five and four if you know you had four of five yet the social one so what does the social one and the relational one mean to you.

[00:39:57] Well and Paulie Bagel theory there is the social engagement system which is okay to look at the Vegas nerve and how we react so like in a social situation when you know every your you look around and you're like oh you see people you know and you're fine.

[00:40:13] You know your nervous system is calm but then a tiger comes out of the bush you know that's when the nervous system starts doing other things but the social engagement is where we typically are in that neutral state with the relationships that we are with in a

[00:40:33] home and our home hopefully we're in a safe space there when we go out you know we look around and go are we safe here you know.

[00:40:44] And that varies from wherever we are for at the grocery store we hope we're safe not always in the United States but you know we should be able to feel safe enough to go to a store or a restaurant or wherever and relax or

[00:41:01] relax or nervous system and be in the moment so that we can have those relationships you know like we are now we're talking on zoom we're not in the same room but we're having a conversation I feel safe my nervous systems all just fine where i'm flowing down the river because i'm talking to my buddy Simon everything's going good now i'm in that neutral zone people always think you have to be super happy but that's a higher level energy and if you're

[00:41:27] in that ecstatic state all the time that's kind of a mania it's not sustainable but i'm not saying don't be happier that's not what i'm saying but you know what i'm talking about that's way up here we're supposed to just kind of flow along and notice and be in the moment.

[00:41:46] Yeah mentor of mine used to say that high tide and low tide no happiness and sadness are merely the high and low tide on the big sea called content.

[00:42:01] Yeah i love that that's good enough yeah thank you about name checking this guy called Richard will be so i wanted to go back to earlier in the conversation then so when I

[00:42:14] you were taking you would just think i think you were just thinking of a response to my question and i jumped in do you remember it i don't know i'll ask you.

[00:42:26] But i kind of jumped in and you said oh no i'm just figuring it so obviously i thought i kind of triggered some you know when you talk about polyvagal stuff i and so she was like as you were talking about it i thought maybe that's what i did with i asked a question too quickly.

[00:42:46] Oh yeah okay yeah but then but it didn't you see say i sometimes i sometimes have caused no upset but i but i think i have.

[00:43:01] Yeah sometimes i haven't i haven't sorry i get it both i get it wrong sometimes you know like i i cause an i cause some upset and i have no idea i've caused it and sometimes i think i've caused upset when i haven't caused anything i don't so i think we're good.

[00:43:19] And we're good good and so i want to go back to the i want to go back to the well so that's interesting then so if you look at listeners if you look if you looking at these five areas of your healing physical mental emotional spiritual and relational.

[00:43:37] That maybe take a bit of a dive into the polyvagal stuff because that might give you that might give you some insights and some healing moments in that as the ray of set.

[00:43:50] But i want to kind of.

[00:43:54] I slightly hesitated to ask this question but i started so i finished right.

[00:43:58] And you said that the the the the the you your world fell apart when you realized that your first month didn't love you and did did you feel loved by your adoptive man.

[00:44:15] Yeah i did but it's this one is one that's really hard to not kind of describe because she did she loved me almost obsessively it was like it was feeling she used me to make herself feel whole which you can't do that another person cannot make you feel whole so she numbed out all of her life.

[00:44:43] She had traumas this was she was a lovely woman but she had trauma that she never ever dealt with she had a forced his direct me she was abused.

[00:44:55] That's why she couldn't have children she had a forced his direct me that's a huge trauma especially when the only thing you ever wanted were kids that's she told me that the only reason why she was alive to have children.

[00:45:08] I mean she was obsessed with it you see what i'm saying that to can become an obsession if the only thing that's going to make you holes to be a mother.

[00:45:19] That's something you need to go look at because.

[00:45:24] Another human being can't make you whole that's a trauma response filling yourself with a bunch of children and stuff is a trauma response.

[00:45:33] And that's what she did she babysit all of her life she surrounded herself with kids and she obsessed her room in line if there was a baby oh my god she would just be like oh I like how cute it is you know we have to go talk to I'd be sitting there just like embarrassed you know going and I never wanted kids.

[00:45:50] I was the exact opposite and I never had kids or everybody would always be like when you're going to have children when you're going to have children like it was any of their business number one and I didn't want them and I'd be like why don't want kids and they'd be like oh you'll change your mind oh you'll change your mind women get that all the time.

[00:46:08] Some of us do not want children doesn't mean we don't care about your children doesn't mean we're not going to be nice to them and help them and you know be a protector if we need to yes absolutely.

[00:46:20] But I never felt called to be a mother and we were opposites so growing up in a household with someone that you don't really have an energetic connection to is like I describe it as like an arranged marriage you know Simon i'm going to tell you that you have to go marry that person over there even though you don't know them.

[00:46:48] You have nothing in common with them you don't really have any chemistry you know that energy that you make she want to be around that person but you're never ever ever going to be able to leave them you have to stay with them for the rest of your life and it's it's a forced connection like I said I she's a lovely person but would I've ever picked her as my mother I don't know I I never had the opposite.

[00:47:18] I was in a forced situation where I had to say I love you whether I felt it or not so that's why now when I say I love you to somebody they know I love them because I don't say it anymore if I don't I can care about people but to say I love you to that's a big one to me I don't I don't like being forced into that situation.

[00:47:47] But anyway my adoptive father was a little bit different I was more connected to him I I kind of did have an attachment to him we were more like we like to go fishing and stuff I was a tomboy I wasn't a girly girl which is what my mother wanted.

[00:48:04] And with funny enough they wanted to adopt a boy you didn't even want a girl I was just a phone call that said hey we got a girl available and that's how I ended up with them.

[00:48:14] That's another thing that people don't realize they always say oh you were chosen you were special it was God's gift no I was a phone call because they didn't get their first choice or their second choice they got me I was the third choice.

[00:48:28] I was what you get when you don't get what you want even though they told me they love me every day I still know I was what you get when you don't get what you want but that doesn't make me any less of a person that is special and worthy of life.

[00:48:44] I love and I know that now because I love me and that's the most important gift you can give yourself is to love yourself no matter what the story is.

[00:48:58] Wow the wholeness thing I was playing with this as I was swimming today and I haven't got it nailed yet but I was thinking somewhere there I think.

[00:49:23] So using your framework I haven't got one for physical but I've got one for a mental mental so believing that we're whole I would say is you know one way of looking at mental here.

[00:49:53] The feeling is the emotional and I had one for the spiritual but I'd love your take on that because you're feeling that you might have a better one than me.

[00:50:14] Well when I feel like I connect to the universe I leave the physical in the mental and emotional behind it's as if I'm in a higher vibrational state and those things aren't as important as it is that I'm just love.

[00:50:42] It's almost all the rest of it melts away for me when I'm in that whole state but that one comes in the quiet places for me even though I can walk around with that also things in this 3D world we live in can bring you down out of that easier than if you are in a meditative state.

[00:51:11] So you know like a dog barking and startling you know you're going to go right back into your body and then that wholeness of you with spirit universe whatever again whatever you want to call it.

[00:51:24] Even though it's still there it's not what you're functioning with in the cognitive day to day so it's always that you're part of it to me I'm always that but sometimes I forget it functioning in the daily so you have to go sit back down and go there I am again.

[00:51:51] It's like I train people to trust their intuition you know your your pituitary grant gland.

[00:52:01] I mean your pineal I said pie to it to your I'm sorry pineal gland I do that with words sorry where you can connect and you practice strengthening that gland.

[00:52:19] So that when you have an intuitive thought where something in your gut when we were talking about this earlier I'm going to digress back to that when you feel it when something says go right instead of left and you're like going wow this is really making me feel like I need to do this instead of that.

[00:52:36] That's how you discern your truth your truth the truth and you have to have that intuitiveness and trust it enough and again that is one of those higher level holes because it's sometimes not easy to trust your intuition because sometimes everything around you or who you're around or what you're consuming you know through media or books or.

[00:53:04] Music whatever it is through your art whatever it is sometimes they're telling you other things and it might not be your truth you have to discern it and it's you're going to have to have that wholeness which you're going to feel it you know.

[00:53:19] And then you have to trust and move forward but it is to me a completely almost outside of the physical sometimes but you'll feel it when you trust it.

[00:53:35] What were you going to say I want to hear yours.

[00:53:39] Being whole yeah.

[00:53:44] It's deeper than feeling whole it's different than it's deeper than believing your whole it's different from it's deeper than knowing that you hold.

[00:54:06] It's so.

[00:54:16] I'm glad to this conversation with Heidi on by the root podcast when she was interviewing me and she was asking me a how question.

[00:54:28] With regard to wholeness and I've never thought about it that I never thought about it this way but until she asked it so I used to think the understanding was a yes or a no right.

[00:54:45] Do you know that two times two is four do you know that the capital of par it sorry the capital of France is part.

[00:54:54] And it's a yes or no and we live in a digital world of sea with screens and everything so everything is a digit is either one or zero right it's really really simple but when we talk about something like when you know.

[00:55:13] Understand our homeless right so I'm just slow down a bit because I'm trying to remember trying to fit that conversation with what's coming on for me right.

[00:55:28] So here's one way of looking at it right so an understanding could be an understanding could be something that we get in our head as an idea.

[00:55:41] Something that we get in our heart as a as a feeling understanding and something that we get in our bones right so you've got understanding head heart bones.

[00:55:57] And then you've got something that another way looking at it would be something okay I've glimpsed my wholeness or I have.

[00:56:11] I've I we come out of the fog right and we come out of the fog and we we were oblivious to our wound before right so we come out of the fog we see our lack of wholeness.

[00:56:28] And then hopefully somebody might point us.

[00:56:34] Somebody might point out to us that they might say to something to us so we begin to suspect we were on the road to wholeness and or we want we'd like to take wholeness out for a test drive.

[00:56:53] And then we see it we get we get a bit more of a glimpse of it and then we have a profound very profound moment when it translate it transfers from becoming a theory to a felt understanding.

[00:57:17] And then we forget it we forget our wholeness and we feel wounded again but then we remember our wholeness and and the next time we feel wounded it it hurts a little less and then for the rest of our lives we are forgetting our wholeness remembering our wholeness forgetting our wholeness.

[00:57:42] The dips the dips yeah and they go up and down.

[00:57:51] I forgot I had to show you something I forgot it was sitting right here here's my parts board.

[00:57:58] All right okay.

[00:58:00] I may because being the creative person I am actually made my parts were my therapist.

[00:58:08] So let me see if I can do a screenshot and see hold it still.

[00:58:17] Yeah got it so there's a screenshot listeners because otherwise that comment won't make sense.

[00:58:25] There you are little bit of an insight there.

[00:58:29] So what how would you like to bring this in?

[00:58:37] That was a way for that I after talking about it. I just kind of wrote my parts down now because that's part of parts therapy you write your parts down you get to know him you name them.

[00:58:49] So I just happen to have like a whole bunch going on at one time.

[00:58:54] And all cold lera.

[00:58:56] Yeah there was a whole bunch some people you know are going to pick out like three to five you know right you know.

[00:59:02] I'm going to do like 16 like I did yeah.

[00:59:06] I went overboard.

[00:59:08] Yeah she's over cheated.

[00:59:10] Yeah and over cheated adopted.

[00:59:12] Yeah it's a trauma response I said was this the trauma response.

[00:59:16] But it was funny but I I went beyond just writing it down and I made artwork out of it because being creative is who I am.

[00:59:25] And it was one of those parts that needed to see it and put colors to it and stuff I wanted to get to know him a little bit more on a different level so while I was doing it.

[00:59:37] I started tapping into that part of me and just you know what color are you what do you feel you know and I that was how I stepped into just a different part of parts therapy.

[00:59:50] And we've done that and well they just did it a few weeks ago in our art group for the adopted chameleons were doing an art group again.

[01:00:01] And parts was the theme.

[01:00:04] And it's just a way to be more creative with it you know to get them to know him a little bit better and hopefully get them all working together because that's the end goal right parts therapy is we're all going to work as one so we can be whole.

[01:00:18] Instead of fighting against each other we're working towards being that whole person now does that say that you know one of those parts isn't going to have a day where it's like I need attention.

[01:00:31] Yeah that that's going to happen that's where you know we might be wanting to lash out at somebody instead of going oh is that my inner child needing to.

[01:00:40] Needing something today did something come up that maybe you know triggered them or made them uncomfortable and now we need to go talk about it so we're still whole but you know there are days we need to go back in there and go hey sweetie what's happening you know how are you not being seen or heard and something usually happen you know maybe somebody.

[01:01:02] Step on your sentence right in the middle of you saying something you were really proud of and all of a sudden you know you're like going oh I guess I don't matter and there goes the lies you know you're going back to that old pathway of I don't matter and you know you go back in there and you're going no you mattered someone was just anxious and they you know they spoke when they probably shouldn't have but they weren't intentionally trying to hurt you.

[01:01:27] Now there are days that some people are intentionally trying to hurt you and you know that's when anger comes up for the right reasons because anger is a valid emotion too think of activists you think they're out there happy no they're angry they're using their anger to change things for the better you know and all the parts are whole we're all needed every one of those parts are needed.

[01:01:55] Some days we need to be angry because it's the right emotion some days we need to be happy.

[01:02:08] We don't hear that word hold a lot doing.

[01:02:11] I used to hear it all the time because I worked at Whole Foods Market.

[01:02:15] I was a marketing manager all as a part of was a part of my world corporate world for many years but you're right in in the mental part of it yeah.

[01:02:28] The wholeness is is often overlooked unless you're doing some parts work and you're seeing that goal of us all working as one cohesive unit being whole.

[01:02:41] I was going to sign off that but I wanted to share something as you were talking about there it goes again the liar what was in the recent.

[01:02:57] The tiger jumping out of the bush you know that's that's why we have that primal part of our nervous system because it used to protect us you know are our eyes got bigger we know we could hear better see better muscles get tense so they can take off or they can fight.

[01:03:14] You know fight flight one of those is going to go off with the sympathetic nervous system you know when the tiger comes but you know it can be anything someone startles you they you know they're trying to take your wallet or your purse or something from you know your sympathetic nervous system goes off that's your primal base.

[01:03:33] That's your limbic brain you know that's that's the most primal part of is that we share with lots of other animals.

[01:03:43] I didn't ask the question quite right and you talked about a liar coming in and you talked about some we finish is the end of our sentence oh okay that that lie of it and and one of the biggest things i've heard in last couple of days is the fact that.

[01:04:05] We have an insight we see our wholeness and then the liar comes in saying we're not whole again and we believe it we fall for it.

[01:04:24] So it's like this isn't once undone right graceful Simon needs to be graceful I need to be graceful need to have grace for myself when I forget my wholeness.

[01:04:42] Yes because in the perfect you know that in the perfection driven world then forgetting something that you think you've seen really deeply is a reason to be is it what is it is in my word is a reason to beat myself up yeah yeah that makes sense.

[01:05:09] Yeah and that's going back to the old programming yes programming that we were familiar with yes where we're working into new familiar you know that no we you know the lies that we weren't worthy are going to be changed our group to the new neural pathways of we are worthy yes we are but it does go back sometimes it goes back to the old wiring.

[01:05:34] Just like you're working on a computer and sometimes there's it's just it's not working you have to unplug it and re plug it back in yes but you're back over to get it functioning right.

[01:05:45] Like the flu did to me you know something like that can happen to us or we get triggered somehow and then we go right back to the old familiar instead of staying in the new familiar and the new familiar has to be taken care of like you said.

[01:06:04] Given it grace.

[01:06:07] So the new familiar does not stop the old familiar.

[01:06:16] Well if you spent 50 years believing one thing and only maybe five years believing something new I don't know the brain science of that I would have to go study on that one but I do know that we can rewrite old programming.

[01:06:33] I mean that's near plasticity we can change the old into something new and take us out of the trauma.

[01:06:43] That is causing the symptoms the depression the anxiety those things we can alleviate it is it always going to be gone no because it's part of us especially if we have CPTSD or adopties specifically with the separation of mother at birth you know that is the thing that is not going to be gone.

[01:06:59] So we're going to be able to do that with the separation of mother at birth you know that is well that's the primal wound that we talk of the the initial separation.

[01:07:12] And it is a part of us doesn't make us who we are no no were other things but that wound is there doesn't mean that we have to keep picking at it.

[01:07:23] Sometimes we will go back into it and we do well as adopties we have reunion you know we meet new family members so it's brand new right that trauma this is someone I don't know it's you know I met a sister I met a uncle I met a cousin this is a whole new thing.

[01:07:42] The emotions are going to come back in but with that new programming we can move through the shock and all those emotions and feelings we have in a more graceful way and flow with it.

[01:07:56] It doesn't mean that's not going to take us down maybe for a second or two but with practice those new neural pathways will go hey hey over here.

[01:08:07] We can do this you're still worthy you know I know that right now you're feeling a lot of things with this new information but let's go ahead and remember that we are love we are loved and we are worthy.

[01:08:22] And if you have to keep saying it over and over again good because repetitions how we learn things think about how Olympic athletes become as good as they are they do it over and over and over and over and over and over again right.

[01:08:35] We have to do with those lies that we tell ourselves we have to go nope we are worthy we are love we are whole and with repetition with practice you know through yoga for whatever mindfulness practice you're doing through your creativity through all of it that's who you become brilliant thanks all right thanks listen.

[01:09:00] We'll speak to you in writing today.